Brewbound 2023 Rising Stars: Torch & Crown Brewing

Jessinfonte [00:12] I'm Jessinfonte, Brewbaum managing editor, and I am thrilled to be here with Torch and Crown co-founder and CEO John Danceler. John, what's going on, buddy? How are you?

Speaker 2 [00:23] Quite a bit. Uh, we're doing great. We, we had a real busy summer, as you know, and we're, we're now getting into the holiday season in New York, which, uh, which is an exciting time.

Jessinfonte [00:34] That is a very exciting time. Now, you've had quite a summer. You, you and I were one of the last official conversations that I had before going out on maternity leave, and uh, I was so excited to share the news about Torch and Crown's new location at New York's iconic Union Square Park, your seasonal installation in the Hamptons, plus you and I chatted a lot about all the things that you guys are getting up to. For all those reasons and more, uh, we're really honored to be able to name. Uh, Torch and Crown, Manhattan's own, uh, Brewbound Rising Star for 2023. So, let's just dive in here because like I said, you've got a lot going on as you shared the busy summer, the New York holiday season. Uh, and that's not all. I mean, I feel like through all the conversations that you and I have had over the years and over many years, Torch and Crown basically operates in hard mode all the time. Your business model is super complex. You've got the taprooms, you package, you self-distribute, and you have a really sizable contract brewing business. What is all of this like and how are you as a leader able to, to keep all the plates spinning at the same time?

Speaker 2 [01:41] Well, um, It, it, we are definitely in hard mode and that started with building here in, in SoHo. Um, it was, I think, really driven by naivety. I think if, if we knew everything we were, that that really was going to entail, it, it would, it would have been a harder pitch, but we, we sort of looked at it, at what the opportunity would be and how cool it would be if we, if we could pull it off and, and Didn't really ask any more questions. We just kind of went for it. And that's been true of a lot of the different sort of things that we've built, um, including distribution, including, um, our, our other locations, and, um, and sort of, I, I guess everything that, that we're trying to do. Um, that I will say is, is definitely not always a good thing. Um, it, we, one of my biggest struggles as a leader is looking at, you know, a certain operation or a certain sort of part of our business and Realizing that it, it, it is suboptimal currently and it could be done a lot better. We have the people in the room to do it, we have the know-how, and we just haven't had the time to execute. So that's a, a constant struggle, but really, we've, we've built, um, the thing I'm most proud about is, is the team that we have. Um, it's a team of, it's a group of people that all dream like Joe and I did when we first started, all want to, to really get out and And do hard things and uh they're driven and, and they don't, you know, they don't stop, they don't go home until the job's done. Um, so that's something that, that's what got us through COVID. Um, we, we opened that, I mean, COVID was horrible for For everyone, um, you know, every brewery across the country, we opened at a time when we were over time, over budget, uh, through, through construction, and, um, we got one week of 25% indoor capacity with all those. Rules around New York, uh, before they shut us down for the winter and it was, you know, having to, to turn around and build a whole direct consumer delivery business from scratch over the course of, of 48 hours. And that was sort of, that was how we got started. That was our, our first, you know, few, um, our, our first few, few weeks, few months in business, and Um, you know, what that, what that's built is, I think, for, for a business as young as we are, is a group of, of people that's kind of battle tested beyond their years. Um, so I can't say enough good things about the, the, the group of people that we have here at Torch and Crown, and they're, they're what's making this hard mode, uh, possible. Certainly, it, it isn't easy, but, um, you know, they're, they're, um, they're what's making it possible. They're, they're, who is, you know, out accomplishing. You know, the extent to which we, we're, we're winning awards or getting news headlines or anything like that. It's, it's all just the, the amazing, amazing group of people we have here.

Jessinfonte [04:35] Yeah, and you're being modest. You know, COVID was hard for everybody in the industry, of course, but you're, you're, you're right in the epicenter. And I remember the conversations that we had in those days. You guys were out doing home delivery. You had a van driving all over Manhattan and you still offer that. So, The way that you were able to pivot the business during that really uncertain time, you've also found things that you've pulled forward from that, that are still part of your business. So, what did you learn in those crazy, you know, months of 2020 and 2021?

Speaker 2 [05:06] Yeah, that is, it is definitely one of the silver linings there is it, it, you know, operating during that time, um, gave us really a direct route to, to the customer that we may not have had otherwise. Um, and I mean, operating so many different business models, so many different things, like, I think we, we have a far better command of our, our cost structure and, and what the, what the real drivers are than probably we would have normally because it seemed like every different week, it was now you can do bar service, now you can't, now you can hold, you know, indoor dining in this arrangement. Now you can, I mean, the amount of like, Different just floor plans in our, in our, in our brewery and restaurant down in SoHo, all to, like, to, to the, the, whether we were selling to, to bars and restaurants at that time or whether a lot of them had shut down and we were, we're, you know, trying to move kegs through a different or move, move product through a different channel, all that sort of stuff, um. It led to, um, I think, really a renewed prioritization in terms of, of all roads leading to the customer. And that's been our entire business model, um, since we started. I mean, one of the, one of the things that we really saw, thought was lacking and saw an opportunity for was bringing Sort of the world-class hospitality that New York is known for, um, into the beer world. Um, we've, we've been to, to hundreds of just amazing breweries that you look on one side with, um, you know, all of the shiny new equipment and all the care and detail and just, and millions of dollars of investment that have gone into that side, and then you look at the side you're standing on where it's kind of a warehouse with some barrels and That same thought hasn't been put to the customer experience. And that was the problem that we set out to, to solve was to be kind of the, the brewery with the, maybe with the, the deepest roots right to, to our community and right to, to our, our customer base, um, to the people who are drinking our beer. Um, And getting up close and personal when people are shut, shut down, locked in their homes. I mean, I remember, uh, so I, I myself did thousands of deliveries, so did, um, everyone on our leadership team all through, you know, the entire company was out, out on the road and, um, uh, meeting customers where they were, which in the early days in, in the, the COVID shutdown was in their homes cause people weren't allowed to go anywhere else. And so, um, that sort of, that sort of customer obsession, um, I think is is something that we have carried with us and has, has really helped us dramatically.

Jessinfonte [07:45] Awesome. One thing that's always struck me about you is how well you guys take care of the team. You know, that was really important. You and I have talked a lot about like the benefits that have offered in the culture. How are you able to maintain that culture at all the, all the time?

Speaker 2 [07:59] Well, I'd be lying if I said the culture was perfect, um, like any growing team, we have our challenges, we have our, our, um, our issues, but I think Um, leading by, by example and going the extra mile for, for everyone, where, wherever we can is, is how we have, I think, attracted a group of people that, that will do the same. And that's something, you know, Joe and I were both athletes up through college and, and the, the mentality of kind of you're, you're in this together, you're, you're fighting towards a common goal together, and you're willing to do whatever it takes to help the person on the right and the left of you. Um, is something that we, we really wanted to, to bring in as a business. And so, um, everything from our bonus structure is all team-based. It's not, you know, not individual performance, um, and, you know, things, things like that, everything from how we, how we train, um, how we train new, new hires where they come through all the different, uh, parts of Um, of the business and, and come through all the different parts of, of kind of what, where they're, they're operating so that we can. Um, you know, so that, that they're cross-trained in case, um, you know, in case we need to change, change jobs or do something different. Um, but really just trying to, trying to select people who are, uh, as committed to, to that teamwork mentality as we are. Um, and we don't always get it right, but, um, I think the, the good thing is, as you grow, as you hire more and more people who really do share this, this sort of common core trait. Um, when you, when you stray from that, when you hire someone who, who doesn't, um, you know, who doesn't embody that value, uh, they tend to, to not last very long. And that, that has been the case. And I think that's something we're continually learning. I myself am continually learning as a leader of, of, you know, if we've found a non-culture fit, we need to We need to fix that problem quickly. I, the, I'm the eternal optimist. I mean, you look around at everything we're trying to do. Clearly, I'm, I'm, uh, you know, always, always looking at what can be great. And, um, you know, I think, I, I, the protecting that culture by, um, by, by making sure that if we don't have a fit, they're not, they're not impacting it is, is something that we've, we've also learned and it's something we're, we're getting better at, I think.

Jessinfonte [10:23] I mean, knowing that things aren't perfect already puts you 15 million steps ahead of a lot of other places. Let's talk a little bit about your big exciting summer. Yes, you had the two new locations. Tell me a little bit about both of them.

Speaker 2 [10:37] Yeah, yeah. So, um, I mean, Union Square was really, uh, a, a just crazy incredible opportunity that came to us at the last minute, um. It, it is a uh location actually on Union Square Park. So it's this iconic pavilion structure, which um is open to the public. It's kind of complete open air, so it's open to the public really only during the, only during the nice winter months. We actually just closed down for the season on Tuesday. We did a, a $1 beer night to celebrate, uh, which went exactly as you would expect, I think. Um. And, uh, but, but that's, that's enabled us, I mean, it's, it's the, the most trafficked transit hub here in the city. Um, and it is, it's a central gathering point. And so being right there and being able to, to kind of spread the, the torch and crown gospel as a, as a part of the city, um, was, was really incredible. So in terms of just the, the amount of, um, You know, the amount of, of new customers we met over there that we were able to, to sort of bring into the, the Torch and Crown ecosystem, but also, um, I think the, the, just the, the being in that iconic location and being the, the, the events, the sort of uh larger scale things we were able to do, we, we, we had a couple of multiple 1000 person events, um, one for actually a, um, A soccer game that was in town, um, another for, for a big Oktoberfest, um, just sort of community events, um, Pride, we did a, a massive, um, the Pride parade goes, goes sort of right by Union Square. And so we had a massive party for, um, uh, for Pride at the end of June. And, um, it was really just, uh, an awesome way to Uh, I guess, be, be a part of, of sort of what's happening in the city past, um, past where we are, you know, um, over in SoHo and sort of, uh, throughout the distribution business. Um, and Montauk was, was also, was incredible, was, was, um, was a lot of fun. Um. It was, we, we partnered with a group out there that, that, they're called Dive Bar Pizza and um fit our ethos pretty well in terms of, of the pizza is world-class, but there's graffiti on the walls and they're, they're a group of people that really doesn't take themselves too seriously and, and um so we kind of became fast friends. And, um, um, so, so we did kind of just a pop-up beer garden in their backyard for um Uh, over the weekends in, in the early part of the summer, which, which was, um, which was a lot of fun to be out there, you know, pouring beers by the beach. It, it really, you can't beat that. Um, but, but it was also, you know, during, during the, the hot months here in the, the summer, you get to mid-August and the city smelling like trash a little bit and You know, it's hot and sticky and all that. People are, uh, people are leaving and, and for us, it's, it's the closest beaches are, are down the shores, as you know, Jess, and, um, um, and out, out, uh, out on Long Island, um, in, in Montauk in the Hamptons. So, um, we were kind of, you know, to some degree, we're just kind of following our crowd out there. Everyone, you know, it was a lot of people we would see 2 or 3 times a week in the, um, in Soho during the week, and then we'd see them there on, on, Uh, on the weekend. So it's a good way to kind of deepen our relationship with, with, um, with our local crowd as well as to, um, to expand a little bit out outward and, and, you know, make some connections throughout Long Island.

Jessinfonte [14:05] That's great. Well, John, we are so happy to see all the things that you guys have been able to do over the past few years, and we are so proud to be able to name you one of our rising stars. So congrats to you, Joe, and the whole team. Uh, we are so happy for you guys. Thank

Speaker 2 [14:19] you so much. This, um, you know, uh, the whole team is, you, you said it. It's, uh, it's a big honor. Obviously, you know, I've, I've been reading, reading Brewbound since, since way back when we were in the business planning stage and, and found it. Um, you know, incredibly helpful from, from the informational standpoint, um, you know, even before that. And so, um, this is, this is huge for, for us, you know, for me personally, but it's, um, you know, everything that we've accomplished, it's really been, been, it's an incredible, incredible group of people, um, that we have working together. So we're, we're all, uh, we're all honored by it.