Wrapping Up 2025 GABF & NBWA Annual Convention; Plus, Rebecca Maisel Interview

[00:00:00] Justin Kendall: Heading to CBC? Kick things off the day before The Brewbound's meetup at Love City Brewing in Philly, Sunday, April 19th from 5 to 7 p.m. Connect with beer industry leaders, grab a drink, and catch up with The Brewbound team. It's free to attend and walking distance from the convention center. Head The Brewbound.com slash lovecity.rsvp. And don't forget to catch The Brewbound team at booth 956 during CBC. Next on The Brewbound Podcast, we wrap up the NBWA Annual Convention. Hello and welcome to The Brewbound Podcast. I'm Justin Kendall.

[00:00:48] Jessica Infante: I'm Jessica Infante. And I'm Zoe Licata.

[00:00:51] Justin Kendall: And we are together. We are in Las Vegas. You two survived the Great American Beer Festival.

[00:00:57] Jessica Infante: Yes.

[00:00:58] Justin Kendall: Survived. A lot of sighs.

[00:01:01] Jessica Infante: It's been a very long week-ish. I don't even know what time is at the moment.

[00:01:06] The Brewbound: Yeah. Well, by the time you hear this, dear listener, it'll have been a week that we've been on the road. Yeah. But we'll be home by then.

[00:01:14] Justin Kendall: Yeah, you will be home. Like, this is the time cop of recording.

[00:01:19] Jessica Infante: So GABF was something. GABF definitely was something. It was definitely a little different.

[00:01:26] Justin Kendall: Well, it was going to be.

[00:01:27] Jessica Infante: Yes, it was and wasn't at the same time. It was very similar to last year and like all the themes were the same. All the like the setup was a little bit similar. It felt a bit more spread out. And then some of the new additions this year was a huge second stage added to one corner, which was kind of off away from a lot of the booths. And then a whole craft distilling section. So tons of spirits pouring full strength spirits. in some various sizes into folks' glasses.

[00:01:59] Justin Kendall: Very liberal pours.

[00:02:01] Jessica Infante: We saw a couple liberal ones. A couple very responsible pre-poured portions as well.

[00:02:05] The Brewbound: In teeny tiny little cups. Yes. It was the required quarter of an ounce. Yes. Other brands were just pouring freehand. We didn't drink any.

[00:02:15] Jessica Infante: No, we didn't.

[00:02:16] The Brewbound: I don't think I... Oh, protest?

[00:02:18] SPEAKER_??: No.

[00:02:19] The Brewbound: I feel like self-preservation.

[00:02:21] Jessica Infante: Yeah. There was already a lot going on in our stomachs with the various beers that we tried. A spicy pickle.

[00:02:28] Justin Kendall: Here I was in the spirit of the 2025 Great American Beer Festival, and I was going to ask you the best beverage that you had, and you drank a bunch of beers, which.

[00:02:39] The Brewbound: We drank some like RTDs too. Okay. I got to say, the booths that seem to be having and generating the most fun, We're not beers.

[00:02:51] Justin Kendall: Yeah.

[00:02:51] The Brewbound: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

[00:02:53] Justin Kendall: Controversial.

[00:02:54] The Brewbound: Yeah, maybe. I think not really. Probably. You were gone by this point, Zoe, on Friday night. Yeah, we did Thursday night and Friday night. Yeah. And we can talk about what Thursday night was like. But on Friday night. I was alone for a little bit. I only had like two hours in me and then I was done with that. I went up to see Beatbox and I asked for a sample of Shaquille O'Neal's Blueberry Lemonade and the woman pouring asked if I wanted Pop Rocks and the answer to that is always yes. So she gave me like a new cup with like a little Pop Rocks rim and then By the time I rejoined some people a few moments later, they were like, what are you drinking? Why is your mouth blue? So, but it was fun.

[00:03:38] Jessica Infante: Pop Rocks. It was fun. Yeah. I don't know if my body liked me very much after the various things we consumed. Are we allowed to talk about Party Bomb?

[00:03:47] Justin Kendall: Yeah, I think so. I mean, he put it out in public. Shit. He walked up behind me here in Vegas and said, Party Bomb.

[00:03:55] The Brewbound: Yes. So the booth that I saw that had a line that ran out of product that was doing fun stuff was Party Bomb, which is a new offering from the crew at Deschutes.

[00:04:06] Jessica Infante: Very different vibe. Intentionally a very different vibe. Totally different vibe. They're trying to kind of be its own thing.

[00:04:12] The Brewbound: Yeah, there's no like, it's not like Deschutes Party Bomb. No. Nowhere on there.

[00:04:16] Jessica Infante: No.

[00:04:17] The Brewbound: I'm sure one day soon we can talk to Peter all about how they make it because there's a whole process that goes in that I don't really know. Yeah. But basically it has something to do with when they make their non-alcs, they brew the beer the way you brew a beer and then they remove the elk and then they uh they turn that into Party Bomb which is delicious i don't even know how to explain it like smb doesn't feel right it's like a fruity punch but in a very like juiced way yeah the pineapple whip what's the abv Like five. Yeah. Something pretty normal.

[00:04:51] Justin Kendall: You were saying about the whip? I'm sorry.

[00:04:52] The Brewbound: Oh, no, like it's like a pineapple whipped cream flavor. Yeah. By the time I got back to them on Friday night, they had poured out of almost everything, but they had a shot ski. You know what I'm talking about.

[00:05:04] Jessica Infante: And like inflatable shots.

[00:05:06] The Brewbound: Yeah, yeah. And people were lining up to take the shot ski and then they had somebody with a Polaroid that would take your picture with the shot ski and then print it out and give it to you in a little neon tie-dyed booklet that said Party Bomb. It's great.

[00:05:19] Justin Kendall: Where's your Polaroid? It's in my purse. All right. Well, I'll check that out at dinner tonight.

[00:05:24] Jessica Infante: Yeah. Yeah. It was quite a treat. Anyone who got to see Peter behind that booth was- Peter was living his best life.

[00:05:30] Justin Kendall: Yeah. Normally buttoned down.

[00:05:33] The Brewbound: The former CFO of this company. Yeah. Was wearing a tie-dyed blazer that he got at Spirit Halloween and just kind of yelling Party Bomb.

[00:05:43] Justin Kendall: And the macho man reflective glasses.

[00:05:47] The Brewbound: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They were in the space section. The sections returned. They were in the space section. They were like kitty corner to surf side who also was super busy. You know what I, and this is not an original thought that I had, somebody else pointed it out and I was like, Oh, that is interesting. It looks like other craft brewers were copying like the Sam Adams Utopias playbook by having special toppings at certain times. So that was cool.

[00:06:09] Jessica Infante: Yeah, there was a number of those more than last year, I think.

[00:06:13] The Brewbound: Yeah.

[00:06:14] Jessica Infante: Also, a former Pitch Slam participant, Crooked Owl, was having a great time at Beer Festival at their booth. They were super popular. We went up to them and they're like, yeah, people are loving it. So that's a hard departure. You know who was talking about it? The flamingos. There was, what's the plural for flamingos again? A flamboyance. There was a flamboyance of flamingos. People dressed up in flamingo costumes for the costume contest on Saturday.

[00:06:42] The Brewbound: So I don't want to say I was a hater, but I was skeptical of this costume contest idea, but people did it. People were dressed up. They were having fun. They were group costumes. There was a flamboyance. I asked the OA to take my picture with them, because when I dress Cora and I need her to stand on one leg, I say, stand like a flamingo. So then I took my picture with the flamboyants, who were all much better at standing on one leg than me.

[00:07:04] Justin Kendall: That's fantastic. Yeah. It sounds like you had fun.

[00:07:07] The Brewbound: I had fun.

[00:07:09] Jessica Infante: Paired was great. Oh yeah. We also did get to go to paired, which was awesome. But I went for the first time last year and it was very impressive. And it was again this year, just really good food, cool beers that you wouldn't really try otherwise.

[00:07:23] The Brewbound: Good vibes. Yeah. I think one of my favorite pairings was at the cane booth. They had a night to end all dawns, which is their highly awarded barrel aged stout paired with a red miso ice cream. Absolutely delicious. Shout out to Mr. Michael Caine, who listens to the pod.

[00:07:41] Justin Kendall: I think I called you a New Jersey homer when you mentioned this.

[00:07:44] The Brewbound: But look, it was delicious.

[00:07:46] Justin Kendall: Hey, I'm not going to argue. I wasn't there.

[00:07:48] The Brewbound: And multiple gold medals that beer has won. Yep. It's not just me. The people have spoken.

[00:07:55] Great American: This episode is brought to you by the Craft Brewers Conference, where big ideas, bold beers, and brutally honest shop talk collide. Join thousands of industry pros leveling up their game. Don't miss it. Register now at CraftBrewersConference.com.

[00:08:16] Justin Kendall: Well, we are now in Vegas at the NBWA's Annual Convention.

[00:08:19] Jessica Infante: No hate to the NBWA or this at all. It's just been a long week and Vegas Las Vegas.

[00:08:28] The Brewbound: I have drank more since we've been on the road than I have in like three years. You've been letting loose this trip. I like it.

[00:08:34] Justin Kendall: How long have we worked together? Six years, man. Six years. In these six years, I don't think I've ever seen you dance so much.

[00:08:43] The Brewbound: Really? Wow, well you're missing out. I gotta step it up.

[00:08:46] Justin Kendall: Clearly, yeah.

[00:08:48] The Brewbound: The band was great last night.

[00:08:50] Jessica Infante: Yes, at the welcome reception last night.

[00:08:53] The Brewbound: And you know what? Was there any dancing Jess in that recap video? No. No. I won. That's the dream. That's what you want. Dance with no video evidence. Yes. Dance like no wholesalers are watching.

[00:09:09] Justin Kendall: Anyway, lots of wholesalers here, lots of people here.

[00:09:12] The Brewbound: Yeah.

[00:09:12] Justin Kendall: I think they're retailers here for the first time.

[00:09:16] The Brewbound: Yeah. Well, I mean, what did we hear this afternoon from our friends in MBWA leadership? They are at like a pre-pandemic high mark in attendance. So we're back.

[00:09:26] Jessica Infante: Yeah. Both the overall attendance and the amount of people on the trade show floor, too, of like actual booths.

[00:09:32] The Brewbound: Yeah, I believe Craig told us trade show sold out. Yeah. Yeah. I just took a spin through the trade show while you guys were recording podcast interviews like responsible people. And I noticed Carbless, huge, huge booth. Yeah. Enormous activation, super crowded. I actually couldn't even get a sample because the bar was so crowded and I didn't want to hang around. Outlaw is here with their light beer, but also light beer tea, which I tasted. I personally can't say that I detected much tea, but could be a me problem. Geloso is here with a huge setup. Surfside kind of went a little minimalist on their booth, but very busy, lots of traffic. They've also done the sponsorship of the staircase update. If you've been here, you know exactly what that means. If you've not been here, you probably are like, what are you talking about? But the stair sponsorship went to Surfside. There's a big Pabst booth in the trade show floor that we're sitting right outside of. Very crowded. Lots of people are on. I was literally the only lady.

[00:10:31] Justin Kendall: One major supplier is missing, right? Anheuser-Busch isn't here.

[00:10:35] The Brewbound: At all?

[00:10:35] Justin Kendall: I don't believe that.

[00:10:37] The Brewbound: Oh, I mean, I've only been to one room so far.

[00:10:40] Justin Kendall: I think Craig mentioned it. Somebody was missing. So yeah.

[00:10:45] Jessica Infante: Mysterious.

[00:10:46] Justin Kendall: Well, I mean, that kind of leads us to the comments from this week's featured guest, which is going to be Rebecca Maisel, the outgoing NBWA chair and the VP of Legal and Governmental Affairs at Gulf Distributing in Alabama and Florida. I think Mississippi, too. She talked a lot about independence on stage for distributors, and this comes as Anheuser-Busch is looking to terminate five to ten of its wholesalers. I sat in on the Michael Madigan, he's an attorney, he talks a lot about the legal issues that are out there, and this is one of those issues that distributors are facing. He described these as small rural wholesalers who essentially don't have the wherewithal to take on an 800 pound gorilla in a several year, seven figure fight. So I'm paraphrasing, but it was close to that.

[00:11:46] The Brewbound: What states are we talking about?

[00:11:47] Justin Kendall: We don't know. That's the other thing.

[00:11:49] The Brewbound: Okay. I was racking my brain throughout this whole conversation. It was like, man, like, how did I miss this? Am I really this stupid? No. No, we don't. Okay. Thank you. Yeah.

[00:11:58] Justin Kendall: No, you're, you're, you're not missing.

[00:12:00] The Brewbound: Yeah.

[00:12:00] Justin Kendall: It's, it's very low key right now. So.

[00:12:03] The Brewbound: But it has the potential to be very high key.

[00:12:06] Justin Kendall: And so she discussed independence being very important, talked about how there's a disappointment when there's this disrespect, and all the while saying, you know, we've all sort of went through it with various suppliers, whether it's red, blue, gold.

[00:12:23] The Brewbound: I mean, nobody likes to be dubbed. No, not at all. Yeah, they also they talked about the White House's revocation of the prior White House's executive orders on competition, which I thought was interesting. But also interesting is that this current White House is directing various industries to submit comments about how regulation is stymieing growth in some ways. And I know the Brewers Association submitted comments about franchise law.

[00:12:49] Justin Kendall: Yeah, it's a hot topic here. Surprisingly, not a lot of talk on stage about THC infused beverages for that matter. Just that they should be going through regulated channels that they're going to be selling.

[00:13:04] The Brewbound: Yeah. Maybe that's something we should ask today because that industry somehow is able to use the postal service. And I know that's a big topic with this crew. Yeah.

[00:13:14] Justin Kendall: Did you want to talk about prom?

[00:13:16] The Brewbound: Do I want to talk about prom?

[00:13:18] Justin Kendall: Nick Moody wanted to talk about Prompt.

[00:13:20] The Brewbound: He sure did. Yeah, that was a really great panel discussion. There was a conversation about the industry's various headwinds and what can be done to solve them. Featuring Nick from RBC and Nadine Sarwat from Bernstein and Mike Frank from Frank Distributing in Wisconsin, facilitated by Robbie Miletus. And Mike heads up the Beer First initiative, which is the MBWA's brand agnostic beer think tank to solve the category's problem, which is that beer is on the down. And Nick and Nadine brought up various things, but what I was not expecting was for Nick to talk about his son's bus ride to the Jersey Shore after his prom and the various stops they made along the way. And he, to his credit, did not say these kids are buying beer, thank God. But he talked about snacks and he was like, you know, prom is an occasion. How can we use that? I don't really know where it was going.

[00:14:17] Jessica Infante: He did clarify before he told the story. He's like, this is not an example of something for LDAs. Yeah. But yes. And you think his point was trying to say there are other events and occasions that include making several purchases in places. And so what are those more niche things that we don't think about that you could capitalize on?

[00:14:38] The Brewbound: Yes, totally. You know, Halloween got brought up, which you and I talked about on this podcast. Impressioned. Yeah. And something that Nadine brought up that we are going to cover eventually this week was how beer is getting a lot of attention in the media, particularly, you know, alcohol, but beer in terms of how people are revisiting their relationship to drinking alcohol and how it relates to their health. But she said that the story that's not being told is that alcohol has been around forever and it's something that serves as a connection point between two people. So why don't we talk about that? And I think a lot of people in this room would like that to be talked about.

[00:15:15] Justin Kendall: Yeah. Something Purser mentioned was the, I don't know if you would call it a loneliness crisis, but it seems to be a lot of lonely people.

[00:15:24] The Brewbound: I missed the stat, but it's like a staggering number out of like X in eight Americans say they have no friends. Oh, it made me so sad.

[00:15:33] Justin Kendall: I mean, we talked about this The Brewbound Live last year, too.

[00:15:36] Jessica Infante: Yeah, I don't know. I feel like also people with no friends are more likely to fill out a survey that says they have no friends. But yes, one of the final conversations of the general session today was Katie Smith from Walmart, and she brought up that socializing is one of the reasons why, too, there's the different buying habits for high and non-alcoholics. People who do want to socialize on the week they do want to have a beverage with them, but they might not necessarily want to be drinking alcohol during the week. So that's why they're buying non-alc. And then the folks that are trying to socialize during the weekend, they want beverage alcohol. They want some of that higher ABV stuff. So they're purchasing that. So it's, it's still very much tied to socializing. And so if you could find ways to capitalize on the people who are going out and hanging out with people, there's still a lot of opportunity there.

[00:16:29] Justin Kendall: Well, it's been a long trip for you both. It's been a shorter trip for me. And I'm happy that you both get to go home very soon. And I get to go home too. And we want to thank the NBWA, though, for their hospitality here. They gave us great booth space.

[00:16:45] The Brewbound: Yeah. Yeah. And a terrific media room spread. Yeah.

[00:16:49] Justin Kendall: You don't see that too often. Yeah. So with that, let's get to our featured interview with Rebecca Maisel. This is Justin Kendall at the NBWA Annual Convention in Las Vegas, and I'm joined by Rebecca Maisel, Gulf Distributing VP of Legal and Government Affairs, as well as the outgoing NBWA chair. Thanks for being here.

[00:17:15] Beer Festival: Justin, thanks for having me. I'm a long-time listener, first-time caller, so this is quite an honor. Thanks for having me.

[00:17:23] Justin Kendall: Thanks for hopping on. So, 11 years on the board, last year you've been chair, and this is the final year.

[00:17:32] Beer Festival: The final year, yes, I'm doing my victory lap starting today as immediate past chair. So it's been, it's been a great ride. I mean, a decade on this board, we have seen all sorts of changes, all sorts of challenges. And that has become kind of the only constant is industry change. So it's been an interesting ride, hell of a ride.

[00:17:52] Justin Kendall: Do you have the come down feeling yet? Or is that yet to come?

[00:17:56] Beer Festival: Not quite yet, although I don't know if that's the mountain dude, just kind of keeping me afloat. But, um, yeah, no, a little bit, I think a sigh of relief after getting through kind of the big general session this morning and knowing that I'm passing the baton tomorrow. But, um, yeah, still plenty of great stuff to come over the next day or two with. Between the general session and the trade show, and then we go right into the brew and Alliance for women and beer making moves part. So plenty of fun yet to come.

[00:18:23] Justin Kendall: Yeah, well, I think I mentioned to Jess and Zoe while you were speaking today, I was like, this is spicy. Yeah, you're going out with some spice.

[00:18:32] Beer Festival: Well, I think I'm, you know, I was kind of in the, in the right place at the right time to be able to speak to, I think what's on everybody's minds and hopefully did so, um, maybe it was a little spice, but in enough of kind of a pragmatic kind of diplomatic way. But, um, I don't think there's any question that a lot of distributors are, uh, confused and left with questions and, and kind of shaken by everything going on. So.

[00:18:59] Justin Kendall: Yeah, and the theme of your talk was independence and the importance of maintaining that for these, in many cases, multi-generation family-owned businesses. we kind of talker around what's going on but you know it's out there in in the media anheuser-busch is looking to terminate five to ten of its wholesalers that's what's been reported and is we talked about during the press briefing today this isn't something wholly new you know it's it's not something that's been unseen before most of course is done it constellations brands has done it to a degree And you mentioned doing this in a diplomatic way, and I think you very much, you were threatening that needle, and it's not an easy one to do.

[00:19:47] Beer Festival: Yeah, I mean, listen, I wanted to be clear that this currently is happening in one network, but it's not the first time we've seen this, and this is not the only supplier that has realigned brands or attempted to force Wholesalers Association and successfully done so. It may be the first time, at least to my knowledge, that it's happened and it's been, at least from what we know so far, successfully executed in states with pretty strong franchise laws. So that is a little bit of a different situation. And just in general, I think that the pressures we're seeing right now as wholesalers across the system are maybe feels unprecedented in terms of just the volume of pressure between pressure to use certain technology, between pricing pressures, forced shipping inventory without approval, and now we're seeing forced sale and or termination. So in that way, a lot of this is feeling, I think it's getting to the system and it's getting to independent distributors and a lot of us are kind of questioning our relationships and it's making us look at things and think about things a little bit differently.

[00:21:02] Justin Kendall: I was going to ask you, what does that do to that relationship? Because these are long time relationships that you have with some of these suppliers and most of them are the largest volume suppliers.

[00:21:15] Beer Festival: Well, I think, you know, it just makes you, like I said, when that trust starts to erode, it makes you look at things a little bit differently and you start to say, you know, and I think a lot of distributors are turning towards, you know, to MBWA to say, hey, what do we need to do? How can you help us? What are some best practices? What are some precautions we can take? And you just start to look at things a little bit differently. Okay, I need to make sure I'm buttoned up, I'm documenting certain things, I need to make sure all my data is correct because it might be put up against the data that my supplier's keeping that I may or may not find to be accurate. And I think it's calling into question a lot of that trust and a lot of how we look at things. You know, that could be for better or worse. Maybe there are some distributors out there that could be more buttoned up and that need to rein it in a little bit. But in general, this is the first time we've really seen this kind of thing. So, you know, I think we're all kind of reeling in a way and saying, how can we ensure this doesn't happen to my company?

[00:22:16] Justin Kendall: How does that change the power dynamics of these partnerships?

[00:22:20] Beer Festival: I think the power dynamics, it kind of depends on the distributor, it depends on the supplier. The idea of the system, the way that it's set up and the laws and regulations that are put in place are in hopes to kind of balance out that power dynamic. But when you have a big, large, global conglomerate and a locally rooted company, That is, you're supposed to be able to take comfort as the wholesaler in these franchise laws that your state legislatures have put into place in order to protect you. And I think what's happening now is people are questioning, what do we need to do to make sure that we are realizing those protections? You know, I don't know. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out kind of across the system. But like I said, I think it's just having us, it's forcing us to question everything in a sense.

[00:23:16] Justin Kendall: One of the other things you brought up was the distracted beer drinker. They're still out there, but there's a lot of other things going on that's pulling at their attention. I was curious to sort of hear more about that.

[00:23:29] Beer Festival: Yeah, I mean, I think we're seeing that. I think it's playing out in the way that some of our larger suppliers have become total beverage companies. And I think wholesalers are in a position where they're starting to take on obviously more and different kind of beverages in addition to beer. And all of it is playing into what are consumers wanting to drink? A full truck is a happy truck from a distributor standpoint. So if there's product on the truck that is safe, that is in demand for consumers, that's something we want to take on. But as distributors, it's a decision that we have to make because a lot of these products don't have the same protections as we have for beer. And having those safeguards, having that franchise law, having the Tidehouse laws, it helps give us the confidence to be able to make the investments in our infrastructure that we need to have in order to be able to expand and bring on more beverage. You know, listen, in terms of winning occasion and the distracted drinker, I think that we're seeing that play out, too, a little bit. You know, I think we're seeing people reach for flavor. We're seeing people reach for N.A. We're seeing people reach for hemp THC beverages. And I think that those people can either be converted back to beer drinkers or converted to beer if they've never tried it. And that's an interesting thing to think about, too. There may be emerging LDA that has never even tried a beer because they went for a raspberry this or a flavored that. And you know, listen, that's okay. But I think we're also interested in getting consumers back to beer. Beer is the oldest kind of, it's been around for generations. It's a more moderate beverage. It's got a little bit of romance, a draft beer. There's nothing like that anywhere else in the alcohol system. And if we can get consumers to come over and taste beer and then start taking further steps and getting into kind of the craftsmanship of beer, right? It's a beautiful, amazing thing. It's not just, you know, not to take away from distilled spirits, but it's not just distilled and infused with flavor. It takes a lot of craftsmanship and a lot of skill to get behind beer. And I think that's a story we can sell. So the drinkers are out there. We just got to somehow interest them in getting liquid to lips.

[00:25:43] Justin Kendall: Mm-hmm. And you mentioned THC-infused beverages. You carry in those, right?

[00:25:48] Beer Festival: We do. We're partnering with a number of THC beverage suppliers, and we're seeing some good success. We're having a lot of fun vetting and meeting, and we're fielding tons of calls and requests, and it's kind of non-stop. But we're having a lot of fun kind of vetting out who we think are good quality producers who understand, you know, kind of the safety and all of the standards that need to go behind, frankly, anything that's consumable, but certainly something that is intoxicating, something where the consumer has a little bit of a learning curve. We want to make sure that we are partnering with hemp THC beverage suppliers who get it. and who are willing and ready to do that education and who are down with playing in the system that alcohol plays in.

[00:26:39] Justin Kendall: What's your sense of what's working in that space right now?

[00:26:43] Beer Festival: You know, it's so nascent. What I see working in our market, you know, I think there's been kind of like a, it's almost starting from a price point to have like some premiumization in it in terms of pricing and then some brands that are going a little bit lower on price. Naturally, there's some more velocity in the brands that are a little bit lower priced right now. You know, some of these brands, depending on where you are, they haven't had to realize, you know, kind of the shift in pricing when it comes to having excess tax. So that's going to be kind of the next level of that. But, you know, I think consumers are just getting their arms around, you know, what are the different brands taste like? We're seeing, you know, there are brands that are more like a seltzer taste. There are brands that are more like a cola. So consumers are just kind of still shaking all of that out. I mean, right now, I'm hesitant to say it's all working, but things are moving off the shelf because there's an appetite to just sample and try. And that's what it seems like right now. It's gonna be interesting to see where it goes.

[00:27:40] Justin Kendall: How big of a portion of your trucks are going to those products at this point?

[00:27:44] Beer Festival: relatively very small, relatively very small. And we know it'll take some time to ramp up. And you know, we just had legislation pass in Alabama this past session that will go into effect in January that will actually limit the account base in scope that will limit the products to 21 up package stores and grocery stores that are over a certain square footage. So it'll come out of C stores. It'll come out of the on-premise. So that'll move the needle a little bit. But, you know, most of our volume right now, just anecdotally, is through those kind of larger format, more regional grocery chains. Grocery chains that have been, you know, willing to take a risk, I guess, in a sense, and come out the gate and carry this stuff. So, you know, Rouse's and Piggly Wiggly down where we are. Winn-Dixie's running a test. But to see the news coming out of Minnesota that Target's going to take the brands and has a full set, I think that's very interesting. And then you've got the other side of that same coin, which is the Ohio governor coming in and issuing an executive order, effectively banning the products. So still all over the map.

[00:28:49] Justin Kendall: It's crazy. It can blow up in one state and it can completely just vanish in another. Exactly. Yeah. As far as what's working in your markets, what surprised you this year?

[00:29:02] Beer Festival: That's a good question. I mean, I think in terms of what's working and it's hard to say that I was surprised by anything. I think there's been some excitement around Pacifica for a long time, and we've been excited about it. And to kind of see that come in and realize the growth that it's realizing, it's like, ah, Yes, the consumer is now seeing what we see and the same thing I think is going to happen with Victoria. Beautiful package, great liquid, you know, and so that's fun. We've had some great success with our, you know, our Voodoo Ranger is still doing great and that was, you know, not new this year necessarily, but it's interesting, you know, continuing to see the kind of people going for the low or no ABV. I mean, athletic in our market is up over 300%. And at the same time, you know, so is that high octane Voodoo Ranger, you know, so it's, it's interesting. It's like, they want really high or they want none at all. And maybe it's that zebra striping, but, um, you know, that's kind of where we want to sit is if, um, if the consumer demands something, the retailer wants to put it on the shelf, we want to be able to provide it.

[00:30:10] Justin Kendall: How have those smaller format cans done, like the Mini Rippers from New Belgium?

[00:30:14] Beer Festival: So it's interesting. They've done okay. We are doing well with them in Florida. We're doing okay with them in Alabama. We're doing great with High Life Ponies. We are on a huge streak with High Life Ponies, and it's been fun to build that brand out in the market, kind of reacquaint the consumer with that package in particular, and then see the lift that it's giving High Life. So, you know, one interesting thing about Alabama is that the way our tax works, it's not a per ounce tax. So when you're buying that, you know, mini ripper, you're paying a tax on a full size beer. So I don't know if that's kind of slowed that in Alabama a little bit, but in terms of that package size in particular, but doing well with it, doing well in Florida and having a lot of fun with that. I love the excitement around that brand.

[00:31:00] Justin Kendall: Yeah, it's a cool brand. And as far as singles are going, like, how are they doing in your market?

[00:31:07] Beer Festival: I mean, singles are like the new six pack. It's incredible.

[00:31:10] Justin Kendall: I think you said that The Brewbound Live. Did I? Yeah. I watched the interview this morning. Okay. It was pretty fresh.

[00:31:16] Beer Festival: Man, so I can't reuse any of my old material.

[00:31:19] Justin Kendall: No, you can definitely reuse it.

[00:31:21] Beer Festival: Yeah, no, single's still doing well, and that's been fun to see, and that's been such an exciting way to light up the C-Store and get a bunch of different fun packages in there. So it's been a good year. I mean, you know, it's hard to get excited in a year where we've had soft volumes, but you got to find the pockets of optimism. You got to find the pockets of what's working and what's exciting. And that's, I think, what I wanted to do this morning, what I wanted to talk about this morning, because if we can figure out, you know, look, what is Coors Banquet doing that they've been around forever? Well, they've figured out their brand story and they're playing into that consumer, and Corona does a beautiful job of that too. And I think a lot of brands have, anyway, have a lot of potential. So it's, everything's gonna be okay. Everything's gonna be all right for beer. Beer's coming back.

[00:32:13] Justin Kendall: Yeah, I mean, it's been around forever. Like, yeah, it's hard to get rid of.

[00:32:17] Beer Festival: Right, right. Can't get rid of beer.

[00:32:19] Justin Kendall: Yeah, well, I mean, hopefully it's moving off the shelves.

[00:32:22] Beer Festival: But yeah, yeah, no, that in that sense. Yeah, some some velocity would be great. But, you know, I think the consumer will come back around. I think they got to get out and they got to try everything. And then, you know, maybe when they start to see some of that decision fatigue with everything out there, they just go, ah, I just want a beer.

[00:32:42] Justin Kendall: Well, I think you pointed out too that the on-premise, there's spending going on in the on-premise and there's a huge opportunity there and it sort of gets back to your message last year about getting back to basics and servicing those accounts and making sure and getting that tap handle that is empty and going out and trying to get that open tap handle.

[00:33:07] Beer Festival: Yeah, I mean, I think if distributors are, if we're honest with ourselves, you know, we got away from doing that in the on-premise during COVID. I mean, obviously, those accounts were effectively closed in most places. And when we came back, there was so much spending in the off-premise that it was easy to focus on that. And I think what we're seeing now is there's a ton of opportunity in the on-premise. And that's exactly right. That's where we know consumers are spending their money. And we want to get people back drinking beer. What better way than a fresh beer from a clean draft line? And I think, you know, Jen Hawk has been jumping up and down at DraftLine, you know, screaming this for years. We've started to work with them and want to pick up on that more too, because I think there's a ton of opportunity there. And I think we just, we got to recall that muscle memory of being super active and engaged in the on-premise.

[00:34:06] Justin Kendall: Well, thanks for doing this, Rebecca.

[00:34:08] Beer Festival: Thanks for having me.

[00:34:09] Justin Kendall: Yeah. Happy to have you.

[00:34:11] Beer Festival: Yeah. I appreciate it.

[00:34:12] Justin Kendall: Well, that's our show for this week. Thanks to Rebecca Maisel for joining us. Thanks to the NBWA for giving us the space to record Brewbound Podcast here in Las Vegas. Thanks to Jess and Zoe for being great co-hosts and thanks to our audio team of Joe and Josh for holding it down here in Vegas and Jon Landis for doing all the grunt work for us. So we will be back next week.